Stop the Inflation!

[eilu]

personally cactapus cream is the worst-hit in terms of inflation, as it's now an unbuyable. They should swap out the disease in expellibox as they do to WoE, to cap this.
on pumping a lot of cash out of circulation: institute a tax on neoboards wherein the dumber post = higher tax. that should decrease the NP somewhat and clean up the neoboards!

[andrewmangan00]

yeh, i think so to. i hate when i get sick from the expelibox! I hate it!

[Siouxper]

I think TNT should lower the maximum amount you can earn from a game from 1000 np to 900 np. Or they could increase the price of the Wheel of Excitement from 150 np to 200 np (I remember when they increased it from 100 to 150)

[Ledi]

I think TNT should lower the maximum amount you can earn from a game from 1000 np to 900 np. Or they could increase the price of the Wheel of Excitement from 150 np to 200 np (I remember when they increased it from 100 to 150)

That wouldn't work. It's not the gamers making the majority of server-breaking money, it's the restockers. A gamer can make, if they're lucky, 30k neopoints a day. A restocker can make 4mil with one lucky stock.

They've already limited us to 3 scores a day per game, AND 1000np per play. That's quite enough thankyou. Something needs to be done about restockers to help level the field for those without uber-fast 'net connections.

Although I agree that a shop selling codestones, pbs etc etc would just defeat the purpose of random events. I fought long and hard to get my lab map back from the glitch of 2002 and I'd be really annoyed to see it simply being sold now. Not that it's that useful with the pound down, since I don't use it on my Draik, Krawk or Hissi...

[Siniri]

I think TNT should lower the maximum amount you can earn from a game from 1000 np to 900 np. Or they could increase the price of the Wheel of Excitement from 150 np to 200 np (I remember when they increased it from 100 to 150)

I agree with Ledi. As a person who predominantly makes money through games, it's impossible for me to make the kind of NP restockers do because of the 1000NP limit -- I actually think the NP limit and the number of games allowed should be raised (at least for TNT games -- maybe not for sponsor games). Inflation has happened, but that limit has been in place for a long time, so it's a lot harder for a gamer to stay competitive when our 3k/game/day just isn't worth as much. On the other hand, restockers' earnings have kept pace with inflation by the very nature of their activity.

There's also a limit on the amount you can make in the stock market (my other income-generating activity) because of the 1000 stock/day limit. This limit also doesn't make sense anymore given the inflation.

Someone will probably say, "why don't you just restock then?" The simple answer is between my computer and my connection, I'm simply not competitive (and the computer's less than one year old, and I'm using wireless DSL, so upgrading isn't really feasible). The cool thing about Neopets is that there are a number of ways to earn NP, so that people can choose one or two methods they're good at and do well (while those who choose multiple methods will do extraordinarily well).

Inflation is a matter of supply and demand -- supply of NP and supply of items. Demand for items has grown substantially because of the significant growth in the number of players. Has supply really kept up? I suppose for codestones/lab map pieces/other items obtained through random events, it has. But what about things you can get in the shops? I would suggest it hasn't, which is why restockers can resell for so much more. I believe this is the largest source of inflation. And because restockers can earn so much more per day than gamers/stock players, they are the driving force in the economy -- they're the ones who control the NP. The other thing that has probably made inflation a little worse is the SSW -- it's so much easier to snipe low-priced items and resell them for a quick profit, it helps stabilize the prices towards the high end.

[Okay, I know someone's going to nail me on the fact that NP do not enter the economy through restocking, only through games/stocks/dailies/random events. This is true. But players who rely on these activities cannot make enough money to buy a ton of the high-priced (inflated) items unless they also make money restocking.]

My solution would be to either increase the amount of items that are restocked in general, or to increase the limits on restocking (longer bans, limits on items, etc.). I know I'll hear a chorus of "that's not fair/that's how I make all my NP/why shouldn't those who are better get to kick everyone else's butts." But every other means of earning NP has limits imposed. Why shouldn't I be able to make as many NP as the game ratios would allow? Why on earth should I be limited to 1k/game only 3 times a day? The game needs to be re-balanced so that restocking no longer has such a substantial advantage over the other means of making NP. By allowing more people to buy items, and having more items available, prices should decline.

[Siouxper]

I have to agree with Siniri on a few things:

I agree with the idea that a few items really need to restock more (Thyora's Tear, Leaded Elemental Vial, and some r100s) because the inflation on these items is horrible. LEVs were only around 24 million less than a year ago, but now they are approaching 32 mil because fewer are restocking. And the inflation on Faerie Slingshot is ridiculous.

Restock bans are already really long, the shortest ban I have "earned" was 10 hours, and I got an additional 13 hour ban within 5 minutes after being unbanned from my first ban.

The way most neopoints enter the economy is though gaming, although I cannot think of a "fair" way to solve this problem because there will always be a "group" who will be dissatisfied with whatever solution Neo puts in place.

[Siniri]

It just occurred to me that the only ways to take NP out of the economy are to buy stuff from shops, improve your neohome, expand your shop size, take a Tiki Tour, put your pet in the lodge, or spend money to play games where the long-run average is losing money (wheels, gambling games, card games, etc.). Avatars for spend-NP games (e.g., lever of doom) helps a little, but the only sustainable solution to removing NP from the economy is restocking more stuff more often.

Oh, by restock ban, I didn't mean banning people for 12 hours; I meant keeping people from buying again in the same shop for, say, 10 or 15 seconds. But this might be too long -- I don't want to keep good restockers from earning a good living.

But to prevent inflation, money in must equal money out. Given the nature of the game, increasing the total number of items sold through shops seems to be the best solution -- either through more shops/more items/more of the same items. This is better than limiting gaming points, because it still allows players with different skills for earning NP to stay competitive.

[Siouxper]

Oh, by restock ban, I didn't mean banning people for 12 hours; I meant keeping people from buying again in the same shop for, say, 10 or 15 seconds. But this might be too long -- I don't want to keep good restockers from earning a good living.

We already have a limit of 5 seconds between purchases (this applies to all shops) I think a slight increase in the price of all items that restock in Neopian shops (a certain % increase) would help to take NPs out of the economy also.

TNT could increase the max price of a NB ad from 4 mil to 5 mil. That would take another 10 mil out of the economy each week.

[metalmario]

I think the only way to take money out that would disadvantage all users equally is to increase the chance of ghost REs that take np from you, and to decrease the ones that you find say 100np on the floor. It's not a big loss to anyone really, but if you take 100np from every player who is online that day, it could take upwards of 10mil out of the economy in one day. Now, that's just a drop in the bucket of what needs to be taken out, but it's definitely a start. Do it every 3 or 4 days, while implementing other anti-inflation methods and you could see some real results after a year or so.

I think the root of the problem of inflation is that there are dozens of ways to make money, but you're not required to ever buy anything. Maybe make it so that if your pet is hungry too long, it can get sick. If it's sick too long, it can revert back to a default color, or angrily take an item out of your SDB and kick it out of the room (your account) Silly, but I'm sure TNT could come up with some interesting ways to require people to buy things.

Also, downing the amount earned from games is stupid. The average experienced restocker makes more than the average gamer in the long run. If you think about it, gamers are "game banned" after only 3 tries!

Edit: I guess I'm talking about increasing the value of the neopoint again, instead of deflating the value of items. I guess I think there should be some items that are just hopelessly out of reach for a lot of people: gives everyone the opportunity to dream about having a JadeSS or whatever

[theonlysaneone]

I think the only way to take money out that would disadvantage all users equally is to increase the chance of ghost REs that take np from you, and to decrease the ones that you find say 100np on the floor. It's not a big loss to anyone really, but if you take 100np from every player who is online that day, it could take upwards of 10mil out of the economy in one day. Now, that's just a drop in the bucket of what needs to be taken out, but it's definitely a start. Do it every 3 or 4 days, while implementing other anti-inflation methods and you could see some real results after a year or so.

I think the root of the problem of inflation is that there are dozens of ways to make money, but you're not required to ever buy anything. Maybe make it so that if your pet is hungry too long, it can get sick. If it's sick too long, it can revert back to a default color, or angrily take an item out of your SDB and kick it out of the room (your account) Silly, but I'm sure TNT could come up with some interesting ways to require people to buy things.

Also, downing the amount earned from games is stupid. The average experienced restocker makes more than the average gamer in the long run. If you think about it, gamers are "game banned" after only 3 tries!

Edit: I guess I'm talking about increasing the value of the neopoint again, instead of deflating the value of items. I guess I think there should be some items that are just hopelessly out of reach for a lot of people: gives everyone the opportunity to dream about having a JadeSS or whatever

You're forgetting that when an item is bought, the NP go directly to someone else. Increasing the price of restocks could solve a lot of problems because the money is literally removed from the Neopian economy.

[Siouxper]

By increasing the amount of neopoints that come into the economy through games, we are decreasing the value of the neopoint because it will require you to use more neopoints to purchase items.

[Siniri]

By increasing the amount of neopoints that come into the economy through games, we are decreasing the value of the neopoint because it will require you to use more neopoints to purchase items.

True. But the reason more is coming in through games is because the number of players is higher, not because individual players are earning more through games. It is a vital distinction, because the inflation decreases the value of NP you can get through games -- the 1000x3 win limit has been in place for years, despite the double-digit inflation rates. Basically, gamers have a TNT-enforced "salary" freeze (unless they play more of different kinds of games, but this takes more time, so it is still a rate freeze), despite the fact that those "salaries" are only worth 10% or so of what they were when I started playing because of the inflation.

The increased number of players have created a larger supply of NP. But it has also created an increased demand for items -- I would bet half my NP that the percent of players who have each of the top weapons/highest-valued items has gone down significantly as the number of players has increased faster than the supply of items. I posit that the inflation is due to both the larger supply of NP and the bigger demand for items. The solution to the larger supply of NP is to take more NP out of the economy. The solution to the bigger demand for items is to increase the supply of items -- provide more items in shops -- which is the major way TNT can take NP out of the economy!

This is the only fair way to get a handle on inflation. It addresses the root cause of the inflation -- the increased number of players, without further penalizing the gamers -- we're the ones already bearing the costs of the inflation; we're not the cause of it.

[Mongrel]

I think the root of the problem of inflation is that there are dozens of ways to make money, but you're not required to ever buy anything. Maybe make it so that if your pet is hungry too long, it can get sick. If it's sick too long, it can revert back to a default color, or angrily take an item out of your SDB and kick it out of the room (your account) Silly, but I'm sure TNT could come up with some interesting ways to require people to buy things.

Didn't they implement one of those a long time ago? Where if your pet is unhappy for too long it reverts back to red or blue? I can't tell what my brain invented and what actually happened in Neopian history anymore.
And they do have an RE in place for Grarrls and Skeiths(I think?) that's similar to your second idea--the pets can eat random items from your inventory when they're hungry. If similar REs were added for other pets, that might help remove items from the economy.
The biggest issue I see with inflation is the Stock Market's lack of bankruptcy. If you put points into the Market, eventually you're guaranteed to get more points out of it. When's the last time a stock crashed? I'd bet it's been years. And while it's not possible to get rich quick the way it is with restocking, I know I made almost 10 million last year with minimal effort, and it'd probably be easier to adjust the Market so that one or two stocks go bankrupt every few months and one or two new stocks join the Market than to tweak restocking all over the place.
Another option, which might be somewhat unpopular: why not make toys and grooming items one-use? There are SO many of them, and you really only need one Diseased Mechafish or Snazzy Moon Comb to make all your pets happy. Making these items work like books would be a start toward removing some items from the economy that are currently worth single-digit amounts and make others potentially worth buying from stores.

[metalmario]

I think the root of the problem of inflation is that there are dozens of ways to make money, but you're not required to ever buy anything. Maybe make it so that if your pet is hungry too long, it can get sick. If it's sick too long, it can revert back to a default color, or angrily take an item out of your SDB and kick it out of the room (your account) Silly, but I'm sure TNT could come up with some interesting ways to require people to buy things.

Didn't they implement one of those a long time ago? Where if your pet is unhappy for too long it reverts back to red or blue? I can't tell what my brain invented and what actually happened in Neopian history anymore.
And they do have an RE in place for Grarrls and Skeiths(I think?) that's similar to your second idea--the pets can eat random items from your inventory when they're hungry. If similar REs were added for other pets, that might help remove items from the economy.
The biggest issue I see with inflation is the Stock Market's lack of bankruptcy. If you put points into the Market, eventually you're guaranteed to get more points out of it. When's the last time a stock crashed? I'd bet it's been years. And while it's not possible to get rich quick the way it is with restocking, I know I made almost 10 million last year with minimal effort, and it'd probably be easier to adjust the Market so that one or two stocks go bankrupt every few months and one or two new stocks join the Market than to tweak restocking all over the place.
Another option, which might be somewhat unpopular: why not make toys and grooming items one-use? There are SO many of them, and you really only need one Diseased Mechafish or Snazzy Moon Comb to make all your pets happy. Making these items work like books would be a start toward removing some items from the economy that are currently worth single-digit amounts and make others potentially worth buying from stores.

Yeah they did, but they're very rare so they're not really a threat.
I like the idea of making toys and grooming items one use. I've had a tombola key ring in my inventory for like 3 years now, occasionally being replaced after a Pant Devil incident, but still, it cost me a total of like 6np over those 3 years? lol