Dirty tricks?
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:22 am
Tell me if this is wrong. I look up an item I've put in my shop, and notice that it's going for between 800 and 920 as the lowest for most lists. I keep refreshing until I see my own shop selling it. I see someone selling 2 of the item for 795; the next lowest is 900. I buy both the items (the only ones in the shop) and shove them all into my shop for 925.
It feels dirty, but it's perfectly legal and not a scam at all. Is it morally wrong or not?
It feels dirty, but it's perfectly legal and not a scam at all. Is it morally wrong or not?
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:26 am
No, not wrong, just good business sense. I do it as well, and I am sure 99% of good restockers do it as well. 
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:32 am
You can't ask somebody if something is morally right or wrong. So you must consult something called Side Constraints.
You can't do something if it hurts something else in the process.
I'm pretty sure that's worded incorrectly, but you get the idea. I can't create a cure for AIDS if I have to kill a human in the process. In the Neo world, I can't earn enough money for a Darigan Paint Brush if I have to scam people out of their NP.
However, what you're doing is artificial inflation. You're buying out other people's cheaper items so you can change the current value of the item, changing it from 800 to 925. Artificial inflation is against the rules.
But then again, 125 NP difference is nothing. It doesn't really hurt anyone; people don't care whether they have to pay 100 NP more for an item or not. Plus, you're buying other people's items, so they are still gaining NP because you're paying for them.
So is what you're doing morally wrong? You won't be frozen for doing something so small scale, but on a technical level, it's wrong. Morally? I think not.
But if I consult myself in this case, I do buy items at low prices then resell them at higher prices. It's called restocking
EDIT: I just reread my post and I realize how hard that would be to understand if the reader, well, wasn't the author. Apologies.
You can't do something if it hurts something else in the process.
I'm pretty sure that's worded incorrectly, but you get the idea. I can't create a cure for AIDS if I have to kill a human in the process. In the Neo world, I can't earn enough money for a Darigan Paint Brush if I have to scam people out of their NP.
However, what you're doing is artificial inflation. You're buying out other people's cheaper items so you can change the current value of the item, changing it from 800 to 925. Artificial inflation is against the rules.
But then again, 125 NP difference is nothing. It doesn't really hurt anyone; people don't care whether they have to pay 100 NP more for an item or not. Plus, you're buying other people's items, so they are still gaining NP because you're paying for them.
So is what you're doing morally wrong? You won't be frozen for doing something so small scale, but on a technical level, it's wrong. Morally? I think not.
But if I consult myself in this case, I do buy items at low prices then resell them at higher prices. It's called restocking
EDIT: I just reread my post and I realize how hard that would be to understand if the reader, well, wasn't the author. Apologies.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:42 am
However, what you're doing is artificial inflation. You're buying out other people's cheaper items so you can change the current value of the item, changing it from 800 to 925. Artificial inflation is against the rules.
It is hardly artificial inflation. That term is used for the mass buying of an item to make it rise in price, and make it remain at a high price.
Deliberately buying items to make the price skyrocket, is morally reprehensible. Trying to make a profit is not.
Don't be alarmed, buying a couple of items above yours is not doing anything wrong.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:44 am
Who's kidding? I've done the same thing dozens of times, if there's a decent gap percentagewise between the lowest and the second lowest. They get their money, and you make a little in the process. Nothing wrong with that, just good business. Banks re-invest the money you put into them, that's how they pay interest. You're just re-investing the item you bought, in order to make a profit, not that much different.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:55 am
There is nothing wrong with that -- it's called reselling or wiz sniping. There are alot of resellers on the site. Not everyone can rs from the main shops.
Now, if you were to, say, buy every one of the same thing you could in an effort to "corner the market", that would be artificial inflation and that is against the rules.
But what you're doing is just fine I'm pretty sure many of us have been searching for something, found a shop with really inexpensive items and bought them up to put in our own shops.
Now, if you were to, say, buy every one of the same thing you could in an effort to "corner the market", that would be artificial inflation and that is against the rules.
But what you're doing is just fine
I'm pretty sure many of us have been searching for something, found a shop with really inexpensive items and bought them up to put in our own shops.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:32 am
If you get a codestone from the Tombola, go to price it and see two people selling theirs for -- oh, lets say 1000 or 2000NP in their shops, then of COURSE you'd snap those up and resell them! It's just good sense. It's not "artificial inflation" because you're only buying a couple that you found cheaper than normal wiz price. Artificial inflation is when a player (and usually a few others) goes out and buys every single one of a specific item, then tries to claim it's worth a lot more than it really is (they'll often offer the inflated item on expensive trades to try to scam people). Artificial inflation is wrong. What you're doing is not, at all.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:46 am
I would only feel guilty if, for example, it is a new item going for less than 10K BUT in my search group, I am the only one selling for under 99,999. It is perfectly legal to buy the cheaper and sell for huge profits. Especailly if a buyer does not know to do multiple searches on the wiz.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:39 am
Also, artificial inflation is not that easy to do. If you see a couple of items cheaper than yours, buy them and put them in your shop for the higher prize... well, it usually takes only minutes before someone else puts the same items in their shop for a lower prize. So what you're doing is not only harmless, it's quite useless too.
Sometimes I try if I can artificially inflate the strawberry jelly, just for fun. When I really make an effort in quickly buying all the cheap ones out there I can get the minimum prize up to 10np for some minutes hehe, but quickly after that prizes start dropping again. Also I have thousands of strawberry jellies in my SDB because of this. Useless, but fun nontheless
Sometimes I try if I can artificially inflate the strawberry jelly, just for fun. When I really make an effort in quickly buying all the cheap ones out there I can get the minimum prize up to 10np for some minutes hehe, but quickly after that prizes start dropping again. Also I have thousands of strawberry jellies in my SDB because of this. Useless, but fun nontheless
Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:48 pm
actually I like people who resell like you a lot, because I restock from the main shops but am always after a quick sell, so everything goes in my shop at the v low end of the price wiz, & gets snapped up by resellers.. I'm happy, they're happy. it's cool. it's a good way that profit can filter down from the people who snap things up in the neopian shops. don't worry about it! & I don't think anyone has ever gotten frozen for it.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:47 pm
Accually you are just monopolizing the market. Buying off the ones cheeper than you so that you have the cheepest price. Although I have no problems with this, there have been reports with rich guilds doing this with stuff like H4K helmets, codestones ect... and TNT has frozen them for it, so I would not get in the habit of doing it.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:30 pm
A. Artificial inflation is not against the rules. It's when you lie and say an item is "worth" 10 million when it's really worth 100k is it wrong. Selling an item for 10 million, or buying a bunch of items and selling them for 99k is not wrong in any way. As long as you don't lie about their current/previous value.
B. Neopets is largely a zero sum game. For someone to gain, others must lose (either directly or potentially). Because of that, pretty much every meaningful action you take to make NP IS HURTING other Neopians in the process.
C. You are not participating in artificial inflation anyways. Items are worth what people will pay for them. If people are willing to pay 925 NP, then sell it for that much. If you think people are willing to pay 1000, but they only cost 600, by all means buy all of the 600 ones and sell for 1000.
D. The situation described here: "I can't create a cure for AIDS if I have to kill a human in the process." is a matter of moral opinion. Machiavelli would argue that the result of millions of people's lives being saved would perfectly justify the taking of one person's life. And if the one person volunteered to give their life to cure AIDS, well that should be morally justified under most any moral code.
But the fourth point is aside the issue :-P
What you are doing is perfectly fine. Keep it up :-D
B. Neopets is largely a zero sum game. For someone to gain, others must lose (either directly or potentially). Because of that, pretty much every meaningful action you take to make NP IS HURTING other Neopians in the process.
C. You are not participating in artificial inflation anyways. Items are worth what people will pay for them. If people are willing to pay 925 NP, then sell it for that much. If you think people are willing to pay 1000, but they only cost 600, by all means buy all of the 600 ones and sell for 1000.
D. The situation described here: "I can't create a cure for AIDS if I have to kill a human in the process." is a matter of moral opinion. Machiavelli would argue that the result of millions of people's lives being saved would perfectly justify the taking of one person's life. And if the one person volunteered to give their life to cure AIDS, well that should be morally justified under most any moral code.
But the fourth point is aside the issue :-P
What you are doing is perfectly fine. Keep it up :-D
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:37 pm
No, it's not morally wrong (unless you're trying to get a monopoly on an item and raise it's price artificially, which is very difficult to do except for rare items because there are so very many). There's a principle in business: Buy low, sell high. You saw items out there that could sell for more, so you bought them. The person selling them got the price they wanted, so you're not cheating them out of something.
It's just basic economics and there's nothing wrong with it.
I found a large box of vintage clothing at an estate sale. I bought it cheap. Paid the price the person was asking. I resold the items that didn't fit me and made a very tidy profit. Wrong? No. I expended time and effort to find the items, prepare them for sale, find buyers, and ship the items to them. The person who sold them to me knew just what she had, but didn't have time to put into it to get the best prices.
When you go out to restock your shop, you're spending time and effort and there's nothing wrong with getting paid more for that.
It's just basic economics and there's nothing wrong with it.
I found a large box of vintage clothing at an estate sale. I bought it cheap. Paid the price the person was asking. I resold the items that didn't fit me and made a very tidy profit. Wrong? No. I expended time and effort to find the items, prepare them for sale, find buyers, and ship the items to them. The person who sold them to me knew just what she had, but didn't have time to put into it to get the best prices.
When you go out to restock your shop, you're spending time and effort and there's nothing wrong with getting paid more for that.
Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:39 pm
Yeah, lots of people, including me, resell stuff using the shop wizard. Don't worry about it, it's not playing dirty at all. Once you buy the item, you can price it however you like afterwards so long as you don't try to convince people that's how much it's worth (if you place the price 'too high').
Basically, don't worry about it and keep it up.
Basically, don't worry about it and keep it up.